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roverman
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Some members actually have them, and yet , their tolerated ? If so, why can't we just discuss this ? Pretty popular conversion is Supra trans., right ? Please don't rag-on about destroying these timeless classics,no one is "buying".They start at about $400 and up. Precious few will sell for their restoration cost(somewhat of a test for a true classic)? So you take a sub-par, JH, say had a "rare" 907 problem? Kinda like, what would Carrol Shelby do? He was affiliated with Chrylser/Iacola, say he chose to go"Tiger" on the Healy ? I feel these cars have better potential, with a V8 than the Tigers. There are more V8 JH's running around, than some would like to admit. They happen to be damn fast. Some even "handle", go figure. 2 cents, roverman.

Judson Manning
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Back in the late 1980s Porsche ran an ad for the 944 Turbo showing every part differentiating it from the standard 944....let's just say the point was a complete job entails a bit more than slapping on a turbo.

Carrol Shelby understood what Porsche was trying to convey to the rest of us: Upgrading the engine means upgrading everything else. That last part is what kills the budget for these otherwise 'great' ideas.

I don't think the idea of a swap is what upsets most people, its the fact 99% of these projects never get finished. In the end, another car that could have been saved ends up disentegrating in someones back yard.

roverman
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Your veiw is understandable. Most of us regret seeing such well intended projects, laid to waste. You don't suppose if their was open, shameless discussion of such projects, with constructive input, more might be completed ? One need only "peep" forums like "British V8" and others to see what "good" happens, all the time. I have no more time, to try and convince this forum, what is possible regarding upgrading of the JH. Thanks, roverman.

Art DeKneef
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I think the reason is a combination of time, money, experience and money. Most people underestimate the amount of time required to do a complete project in hopes of getting the car finished and on the road.

When I decided to restore one of my JHs I thought it would be cool to do the Rover V-8 option. Sure the car would be fast and maybe handle but let's look at what I thought was needed. Try and find the Buick/Rover aluminum V-8, then figure what was needed to mate it to the current transmission or put in a different trans, does the rear-end need to be beefed up, what's needed to fit to the current front suspension. How many parts do I have to fabricate and test? How much help can I get when I need it?

It sounds good doing the swap and it looks doable on writing it down and estimating the time. I think that practically all the restorations I have read here and on the Jensen list the time and cost have exceeded what was orginally planned. And that was doing the restoration with known parts. Now try to figure out what might happen with all the variables of a different engine. Sure it's been done but I don't think there is a lot of information available on how to do it.

There have been ads of V-8 JHs on eBay showing the V-8 being a Checy or Ford. Sure it can be done. But I think one of the reasons people get a JH is to drive the car and enjoy it. I know I did. The car looks good, handles good, is realtively easy to work on and is different enough from the current crop of cars.

I don't fault anyone who wants to modify their car. I'm modifying mine some because it's what I want to do. Hopefully I'll be finished around the beginning of the year but there's always something happening to mess with the time estimate. At least I'm at the putting it back together stage now.

I'm curioue though. If you have no more time trying to convince the forum of what's possible for the JH, why did you start this thread? I don't mean to sound like a smart a$$ I'm just wondering. When you have brought up the subject previously, I enjoyed the different opinions even when the conversations got a little "testy".

Judson Manning
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There is an extremely easy way to convince everyone of a JH-V8's capability: Build one.

Build one, take it to car shows and campaign it in various Ralleys, Road Races and Drag Races. Drive it along side Yellow Dog, the original Huffaker cars or Bruce Qvale's National title winner.

In short: put up or shut up. There is no easier way to prove a point....

Greg Fletcher
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You can talk about engine transplants all you want, I can't imagine it's a big deal to most people. As this group is called the Jensen Healey Preservation Society, I would not automatically assume everyone is completely gung-ho on the engine swaps, nor has experience doing them.

I don't see all that many JH engine swaps around here. Unfortunately, the JH engine transplant projects I have seen over the years have not been been very inspired. That's not to say they are not out there, I just haven't seen them. Some have been outright barbaric. I once saw one converted to a Mazda rotary engine (about 110hp) and the crazy guy that owned it payed thousands to have it done. It was really sad. I did see a really nice looking conversion to a Datsun straight 6 engine years ago. The owner admitted he spend $25K to "have it done properly" and it did look fantastic, but I don't think it did anything to enhance the cars value.

Jensen Healey
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Let's face it, the JH has an exotic engine and a V8 is not exotic. The rest of the car is parts bin stuff. Remove th engine and remove the soul of the car.

For me, the lure of the JH was the engine and it's British origins. In 1973 the 4 valve engine and the 7000 RPM redline were totally outside the norm.

It blew the doors off Austin Healeys, Alfas, Triumphs, MG's and the like, not that I race, I love all those cars.

Have fun with your car and modify it as you see fit. 

Kurt

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roverman
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Thanks Kurt.  I feel like I belong, in the British V8 Forum. Plenty of free thinkers who are willing to share their, innermost ,car hacking thoughts. I see the MGB as the "Chevy" of British roadsters/GT's. Popularity seems to have nothing to do with "substance". I have an MGB roadster, but I believe the JH has the most potential,(properly sorted). I seem to be a "caca magnet", with the preservationist, but I just consider the source. Time will tell, if I can produce an enduring winner. Regards,  Art.

Brett Gibson JH5 20497
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I would love to comment on this discussion Art but your "wordage" just smack's of confrontation.

But if you would post some picture's of your personalized JH that would be great, it's always nice to see what owners get up to.

Brett

Art DeKneef
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Brett,

Are you responding to Roverman Art or me Art DeKneef? I hoped my reply would not come across as "confrontational". Just posting my observation and thoughts to the original post.

superk83
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I was able to get my engine and trans so cheap because the Jensen owner swapped in a gm l67 v6 and a t5 trans... more power than a small v8 and lighter...

healeyneil
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The engine is the best bit, which is why I took it out of a completely rotten JH and put it in an Austin Healey Sprite !

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Pics? I'd love to see that. It must totally mess with folks when you lift the bonnet.

What there much cutting involved to get it to fit?

JodyKerr
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ohm and I'm in full support of engine swaps, btw, just please send your unused engines, transmissions and differentials to me. :)

healeyneil
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This pretty well describes the installation  http://healey.hyperboards.com/index.php?action=view_topic&topic_id=579

A lot of work, but the end result is lots of fun !

superk83
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That is gorgeous! I can't think of anything else to say...

superk83
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Any chance you have any bits of rotten JH left over?

healeyneil
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I sold off as much as I possibly could to other enthusiasts at the time. Anything specific you are looking for ?  Neil

superk83
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Pretty much looking for a roller at this point... brakes, rear axle, steering... hehehe! I'm building a Locost using the motor and four speed...

Somebodystopme!!
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I just bought a Healey and will eventually put an LT1 with a 4L60E into it. I sold my Jaguar XJS 3 years ago that I did an LT1 swap in and it was a blast. The engine will be a little heavier than the 907.

 Lotus 907  275 lbs inc. alt. & starter, no clutch 140HP


405.5 lbs – LT1 (5.7L) Auto with oil and flexplate 275HP

130 lbs more weight for alot more HP. There is only 7 or 8 wires to hook up the factory harness and computer for the LT1. The automatic would be more comfortable for a 6'-2" driver. I like to shift but it get old after a while.

Right now the lotus 907 and 4 speed is running way to good to pull out... Unless someone want to buy it.

Just uploaded a new youtube video of it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WsRnUeSaFaA

 

 

JodyKerr
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Whereabouts are you located?

And if you're going to put an engine like that in make sure you find a good diff to support it. You may want to look at some of the late 90's pontiacs, they had trailing arm suspensions.

Somebodystopme!!
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I live in Southern CA but come over to AZ quite often for work. I'm not the kind of guy that raggs on his ride whenever I'm behind the wheel but if the diff does give it up I have read on here where some have said that an S-10 would fit with some minor modifications.

 

Jensenman
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An S10 rear can be used, but when I built my rotary powered J-H from a retired SCCA IT car I found that a Mazda RX2/808/Mizer/GLC/RX3 rear axle is within 1" of the J-H axle. So I used a Mazda RX2 rear axle with a RX7 limited slip and also the RX7 rear disc brakes. You'd have to either fabricate upper brackets to use the two stock J-H arms or, as in my case, go with a 3 link setup with a Panhard rod. It's good to around 300 HP and is a good bit lighter than the S10 piece, plus it has a good aftermarket.

The 180 HP rotary has been fun, but I'm now leaning more and more toward V8 torque for hillclimbs. I keep looking hard at the Toyota 1UZFE quad overhead cam V8 from the Lexus LS400. Tough as nails (it is derived from a Toyota F1 project engine), cheap because the salvage yards despair of selling them, manual transmission conversions available, lighter than a comparable Big 3 cast iron lump (or even an LS1), much more powerful than a Rover V8.

And before anyone calls me a butcher, my other J-H is a restored JH5 with the 907 which I adore. :-) One of these days I will get a GT to restore as well.

 

Last edited on 12-03-2011 09:09 pm by Jensenman

superk83
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Those are really popular swaps for 2nd gen Supra guys... Fantastic motors! The Aussie crowd seem to adore them..

other
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Jensenman wrote: An S10 rear can be used, but when I built my rotary powered J-H from a retired SCCA IT car I found that a Mazda RX2/808/Mizer/GLC/RX3 rear axle is within 1" of the J-H axle. So I used a Mazda RX2 rear axle with a RX7 limited slip and also the RX7 rear disc brakes. You'd have to either fabricate upper brackets to use the two stock J-H arms or, as in my case, go with a 3 link setup with a Panhard rod. It's good to around 300 HP and is a good bit lighter than the S10 piece, plus it has a good aftermarket.

The 180 HP rotary has been fun, but I'm now leaning more and more toward V8 torque for hillclimbs. I keep looking hard at the Toyota 1UZFE quad overhead cam V8 from the Lexus LS400. Tough as nails (it is derived from a Toyota F1 project engine), cheap because the salvage yards despair of selling them, manual transmission conversions available, lighter than a comparable Big 3 cast iron lump (or even an LS1), much more powerful than a Rover V8.

And before anyone calls me a butcher, my other J-H is a restored JH5 with the 907 which I adore. :-) One of these days I will get a GT to restore as well.

 


Just found this thread, and I have to say, I'm with Jensenman 100%. . . The 1UZ-FE Lexus Quad-Cam 32 valve V8 is an awesome piece of equipment, although to fit one in a Jensen Healey, you need the rear sump engine from the SC400 Soarer, not the LS400 Celsior. How do I know ? I'm building one at the moment ! (see attached 'before' pic). Before the purist start howling about the unseemly violation of a perfectly good JH, I want to clarify, IT'S NOT ! This is a rusted out parts car, purchased to provide an ongoing supply of spares for my first love, a beautiful 907 engined Mk1 (1140-10028). Had the "Frankenhealey" plan not come up, this poor car's fate was to be raped for evey useable item removable from her dilapidated carcase, and then into the crusher, as an uneconomical repair. So, in effect, this terrible plan has really SAVED her. I have fitted an Extreme Performance moly flywheel, adapter bellhousing, and R150 5-speed manual, and am currently in the midst of fabricating stainless steel long primary headers. I will be fitting an entire rear axle from a Holden Commodore VL Turbo (disc brakes and interchangeable Borg Warner ratios, and upgrading the front rotors and calipers, probably LC, LX, or UC Torana look to be the closest options, and keep the same stud pattern as the rear. Then the fun starts, with the standard ECU (aftermarket ECU's make licensing difficult here) has 144 (count 'em !) wires into it ! Most of them are superfluous to this project, but, phew ! Anyway, I defend the decision to do this, and understand the enormity of the undertaking, so feel free to shout me down ! I hope this awful project doesn't sour you all against me, as I am amazed at the depth of knowledge on this board, and as a long term Healey owner, I don't doubt I will have occasion to beg advise for my Lotus engined car in the future.

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Greg Fletcher
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Wow, that looks like quite a project! Please keep us updated on your progress, I'm really interested to see how this goes. How much does that engine weigh?

other
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Thanks Greg, I will post updates as I progress, although they may not be that frequent. This project is progressing alongside a bare metal respray of my Mk1, and 3 very involved motorcycle builds . . . . so a little bit at a time ! The engine itself weighs 149 Kg, with oil, alternator, P/S pump (bin !) and A/C compressor (bin as well !), but without the flywheel and clutch. Once the clutch components arrive (a hybrid concoction of Landcruiser and Skyline R32 stuff . . .) I will weigh the whole issue with gearbox attached, for comparison with the JH drivetrain. This is probably a more meaningful number, I think. The engine will sit back as close to the firewall as practical, to keep the weight distribution as even as possible. I have corner scales for my race car, but as these are only rated to 200 Kg per corner, I may have to get clever if I want to build the Healey on them . . . . Although not heavy, the 1UZ is physically quite large for a small vapacity V8, being 90 degree V, with each bank sporting 2 belt driven OHC's and 4 valves per cyl. so just squeezing the width into the little JH engine bay is a bit of a challenge. Still, wouldn't be as much fun if it was easy !

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superk83
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That is a fantastic project! Please keep us updated... The 1uz is a brilliant piece of equipment. I may have missed it, but what trans are you using?

other
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Thanks for the support. The transmission is a 5 speed R150 from a 2006 Hilux WorkMate 2WD. This is mated to the 1UZ with a KP Racing adaptor bellhousing (they are a drift shop primarily, based in Thailand, but the bellhousing is brilliant quality !). The clutch is a hybrid affair, utilising a 10" Landcruiser disc for the spline match, and a D40 Navara or R32 Skyline HD pressure plate and release bearing to suit the bolt pattern on the Extreme Performance chrome moly flywheel. Time will tell how well this all works, but it has been done before with some success . . . . .

roverman
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Thank you Greg, for letting us discuss engine swaps here. I'm building a 74' Hemi Healey. As many others have mentioned here, this requires a ground-up approach, to execute successfully. The gen III, 6.1L hemi engine weighs 200 lbs additional, over the 907. Carefull component selection and placement, is required to maintain proper vehicle dynamics. The Huffaker fenders allow 5" more track width, much needed. Vette C5 torque tube and Boxster 6 speed , completes the drivetrain. The conceptual, photoshop rendition, is at "BritishV8forum", webbsite in the "Healey" section.  Happy Holidays everyone, roverrman.

other
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roverman wrote: Thank you Greg, for letting us discuss engine swaps here. I'm building a 74' Hemi Healey. As many others have mentioned here, this requires a ground-up approach, to execute successfully. The gen III, 6.1L hemi engine weighs 200 lbs additional, over the 907. Carefull component selection and placement, is required to maintain proper vehicle dynamics. The Huffaker fenders allow 5" more track width, much needed. Vette C5 torque tube and Boxster 6 speed , completes the drivetrain. The conceptual, photoshop rendition, is at "BritishV8forum", webbsite in the "Healey" section.  Happy Holidays everyone, roverrman.
Wow, now that IS an adventurous project, but the result will be awesome to drive. I'm not that familiar with American hardware (OK, I know the Boxster box isn't American . . ), but I love the torque tube as a principle. One of my early plans for my own car was Porsche 928S running gear complete, but was put off by a couple of things. A) Auto trans, as manuals are SO rare, and B) the ridiculous price of parts, even old second-hand junk, with Porsche stamped on it. Only advantage was 50:50 weight distribution with the front engine, rear transaxle gearbox and torque tube arrangemant. There would be secondary benefits to chassis rigidity, as most of the torque stress is diverted away from the monocoque, so the car isn't trying to wind itself into a spiral under heavy acceleration . . . However, that plan had to be dumped in favour of the current 1UZ-FE option. Yime will tell if it was the right decision ! Best of luck with your build Roverman, and keep us updated please ! (PS, Where are you based ? )

roverman
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Update>>I have several reasons, for the Vette C5 torque tube: strenght to weight, rubber coupled drive shaft at each end, and the rigid aluminum outer tube will add substantial torsional and beam strength to the highly flexible standard tub.Yes, there are many different, "smart" motors available now, but I wanted a "Hemi Healey". Yes, it's not a "real" Healey as some would say, but it's close enough for me. This engine will be just dumb enough, that I can work on it. This means Megasquirt III contol of ignition and (2) tbi's on an Edelbrock dual plane/quad manifold. Target is 450+ hp. at the wheels. I don't anticipate too much nodding-off, while piloting, in Riverside County. Cheers, roverman.

Last edited on 12-07-2012 05:46 pm by roverman

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roverman wrote: Yes, there are many different, "smart" motors available now, but I wanted a "Hemi Healey". Yes, it's not a "real" Healey as some would say, but it's close enough for me. This engine will be just dumb enough, that I can work on it. This means Megasquirt III contol of ignition and (2) tbi's on an Edelbrock dual plane/quad manifold. Target is 450+ hp. at the wheels. I don't anticipate too much nodding-off, while piloting, in Riverside County. Cheers, roverman.
Mine should be about 100 HP down on yours at the wheels, but even that should keep me on my toes ! Wish I could go Megasquirt or Woolf 3D or similar, but registering anything modified with aftermarket ECUs here is a pain. Gotta do emissions tests etc, even though any pre '78 car is automatically exempt ! Please update progress periodically, I love these sorts of projects.

roverman
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I suggest a "peep" at the "BritishV8Forum", as there is a least one conversion, with your engine of choice. I believe in a TR7 ? As you may know, they have smaller engine bay, than our cars. Good Luck, roverman.



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