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mdutch
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Well crap.  I just got my JH newsletter today, and have read with trepidation about the Aluminum tanks.  Of course, last summer I considered carefully and looked at options, then laid down the hard bucks to Jorge.  Caveat Emptor.  It looked reasonably like a tank, and the welds were generous.  I will NOT fight the good fight over who is right and what is good workmanship, but will try to salvage what's here. 

Given the experiences outlined in the JH article, I'm open for a roundtable of suggestions on how to proceed with this new aluminum tank that's virgo-in-tank-ta.  ;)

Possiblities I've considered (please suggest your own):
1.  Thorougly measure this sucker against the exisiting rusty steel tank, esp. as pertains to dimensions around the neck.
2.  Pressure test the tank, and/or skip to 3.
3.  Pre-emptively seal the inside of the tank with  ___________?  (insert name of favorite tank sealer goo here).

If anyone else has purchased an aluminum tank from aforementioned supplier and has comments, I'd appreciate them sharing their experience, either here or via PM.  You can e-mail me personally through jensen at audiowizardry dot com.

Last edited on 01-24-2008 03:08 am by mdutch

Brett Gibson JH5 20497
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Man I'm sorry to hear people having trouble with these new tanks, you would think for that kind of money the bugs would be worked out, at the same time I also think that it was nice to see a company step up and help out the JH world to fill a void, goes back to the old saying " no good deed goes unpunished ".

Personally I think I would do what Erik Hawkes did and just make it work with a few mod's, as for sealing with a bit of RTV, heck if I didnt use that stuff there would be more fluids on my garage floor than in the car, I dont understand why that would be a issue.

my 2 cents. / Brett.

Brett Gibson JH5 20497
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Man I'm sorry to hear people having trouble with these new tanks, you would think for that kind of money the bugs would be worked out, at the same time I also think that it was nice to see a company step up and help out the JH world to fill a void, goes back to the old saying " no good deed goes unpunished ".

Personally I think I would do what Erik Hawkes did and just make it work with a few mod's, as for sealing with a bit of RTV, heck if I didnt use that stuff there would be more fluids on my garage floor than in the car, I dont understand why that would be a issue.

my 2 cents. / Brett.

Gary Martin JH 15371
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I also bought the Aluminum tank back the fall of 2005 as part of the original order of  tanks. However I am still working to paint my car and have not installed it yet. The tank is pretty much an exact copy of the original, the only difference I see is some of the vent tubing inside the top of the tank is a little different, but not an issue. The welds on my tank look fine. As noted the main issue with the tank is the seal on the side for the sending unit. Do not use the plastic ring that came with the tank. It is the right thickness, but is too hard to seal properly. The original rubber seal is too thin, either try to use a second seal like Erik Harkes has done, or perhaps construct a thin Aluminum ring to take up the extra space. Place the ring or second seal outside between the sending unit and locking ring. Tighten carefully so you do not bend the three tabs, or deform the sealing surface inside. Its too bad they did not use some thicker Aluminum for the sending unit flange area. I would not be opposed to using a small amount of some gas resistant sealant on the rubber seal if it did leak. Try first without. Once you have the sending unit sealed, it may not be a bad idea to have the tank pressure checked before installing to make sure all is well. I would stay away from coating the inside of the tank unless the welds leaked. I also would not paint the outside, Aluminum oxidizes and naturally prevents corrosion. See the 6 pages of comments in this forum under New Aluminum Tanks.

When installing the tank, use rubber strips underneath and behind the tank. Be sure to place some rubber between the steel tank straps and the Aluminum tank, or construct some Aluminum straps. If you don't, you can get what is called Galvanic corrosion, that is corrosion between to dissimilar types of metal. 

Gary

Harkes
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I could try and make a picture of the seal if interested? Indeed the aluminium is a little soft, so one has to be careful when tightening the locking ring.

I have tried the white locking ring provided with the tank and it leaks! so do not use! I followed up Gary's advice and went for a 2nd rubber seal. I haven't used any sealant, installed the tank, filled her up to the top and it stays dry.

I have been driving the car with the new tank and no issues at all.

The alu tank is indeed an exact copy of the original except for the vent tubes, but that is not a problem at all. On my tank all the welds look good.

Only issue is the white locking ring and therefore making it seal well.

Good luck

erik

mdutch
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I appreciate the heads-up on the locking ring.  As a "handyman" as well as bad mechanic, I raised an eyebrow at the enclosed white nylon ring for the seal.  Looked like a gasket for a sink drain.  So I will definitely pay attention to the sending unit sealing.  I will take my time with the sending unit, and under the circumstances, do a "bench" setup on all the seals


If I were to put a little pressure behind the water leak test, what would you suggest?  5lbs?  10lbs?  15lbs?

--Mark

Greg Fletcher
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What really alarmed me about the replacement tank issue is that weird seal they come with. I can't imagine why the builder can't improve on this. The original story in question (see previous thread) mentions that the JH owner had his mechanic do the install and the mechanic was the guy that raised the red flag on the whole seal being a bogus fix- they prefer I not mention the mechanics name, but he is a well known expert with a highly respected shop and and has decades of racing experience. I would be concerned if I owned one of these tanks and I would certainly take the time to complete a correct repair as Erik has done.

As far a replacements go- you can't beat Renew Tank Repair that these guys do < http://www.gas-tank.com/>. This is very high quality, permanent repair that will not fall apart with age.

mdutch
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Harkes wrote: I could try and make a picture of the seal if interested? Indeed the aluminium is a little soft, so one has to be careful when tightening the locking ring.
[snip]
Good luck
erik

I'd really like a photo and/or description of what you came up with, as I will be dealing with this next month.  If you have a photo, or sketch with dimensions and a description of the materials used, I'd be very grateful.

Greg, I agree this "build" is a disappointment.  However, unless I'm mis-reading things, it seems the only big issue here is the sending unit area.  I will do a water test (no pressure) to check the welds this weekend, and see how my welds are.

Again, os there any value in pressure testing the tank and if so, at what PSI?  I thought as a 70s car it would be vented through the cannister, so no pressure build-up would occur.  Any pressure build up I would think would be nominal, but I defer to those more experienced for guidance!

Last edited on 01-29-2008 07:04 pm by mdutch

James Wilson
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After contemplating buying a replacement for mega-bucks (£450 + shipping + 17.5% VAT ~ $1100!) I decided to have the old one repaired with a new bottom welded in. I used a local radiator shop and it cost 1/5 of the replacement tank's cost.

Its been pressure tested and guaranteed. I've painted it with POR15 and will mount it with a bit of clearance underneath, so it should be rust proof....

mdutch
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mdutch wrote: If I were to put a little pressure behind the water leak test, what would you suggest?  5lbs?  10lbs?  15lbs?

--Mark
Repeating myself, because I have no answer yet and really don't know if there's any value in pressure testing a fuel tank which theoretically should not have pressure in it...

If I were to put a little pressure behind the water leak test, what would you suggest?  5lbs?  10lbs?  15lbs?
Any advice guesses out there?  I really have no idea what's appropriate here.

Greg Fletcher
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Try 10 lbs and you'll see what it can handle.

Jensen Healey
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When we pressure test plumbing pipes we use 4psi. Believe me, when a cap blows off there is a loud pop!

Water cannot travel in the tiny crevices where solvent can. I would start with about 2psi and use a spray bottle of soapy water if it doesn't hold pressure. When the tank starts bulging you'll know it's enough pressure.

Kurt

mdutch
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Thanks for the feedback. 

I didn't want to over-pressurize it since a fuel tank is not supposed to carry internal pressure, and I had received a message suggesting 20lbs.  That seemed excessive.  I mean really, it's a gas tank, not a radiator.  I'm not trying to pop dents or split seams here!

roverman
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Hello all, I'm considering purchase of "TANKS INC" p.n.# U3-g , factory galvanized steel , universal fit gas tank for use in Healy/later and MGB. roadster/now. They seem to be knowledgeble/reputable- a good combination. I bought a 55-57 Chevy Stainless tank from them. It appears flawless. Not tested yet. I suggest logging into their webbsite regarding this and other tanks. I havent yet discussed if they can/would move "filler" to center. Standard cost is $250.00. Stainless not listed but if there is enough interest?   Fuel for thought, roverman.

JodyFKerr
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There's a fllow named Gorge out in california that makes aluminum gas tanks for the JH. I think min cost me $350.00. It's rally pretty, shiny and lighter than heck.

roverman
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Thanks for the response, but I typed in "George of California" to scource the tank on Internet.... it didn't work. roverman

Art DeKneef
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His name is Jorge. Check the previous posts about the tanks.

He also has a JH tank on eBay right now that ends in a day.

Art

roverman
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Thanks Art. I sent my questions about e-bay tank to "angelheartpancho" regarding problems and guarrantee, heehee. I hope he has one. Art/roverman.

roverman
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Hello, Well I'm hoping this isn't the same guy/mfg'r. as described in previous post with inherent design/material and attitude problems. I intend to inspect said tank at point of purchase. I'll be looking for problem areas.  Anyone out there know what standard fuel pick-up I.D. in inches is? Any suggestions? Thanks, roverman.

roverman
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Same Jorge as on e-bay ad now? roverman.

Greg Fletcher
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It's the same dude.

roverman
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Looks like "buyer beware", Thanks, roverman.

roblanford
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Hi, I'm replying to the question about pressure testing the fuel tank. My suggestion is don't do it. Just think about the math involved on one side -1 foot by 2.5 feet -so that is 2.5 x 144 x 10psi = 3500lbs pressure on one side. If you only use 1psi it will be 350 lbs of pressure on one side. I would suggest putting a cup or so of diesel fuel in the tank and rotate it to check the seams. The diesel will leak easier than water or gasoline.

Robert

Last edited on 01-20-2009 07:06 am by roblanford

timeforwalkies
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Just a short update to the Jaguars By Jorge aluminum fuel tank problems.
I had my existing steel tank repaired but was concerned that in the future the tank might develop another leak.  Jaguars By Jorge put his tanks on sale, plus free shipping so I decided to take a chance and buy one for future use.
I don't know if the sending unit flange problem was solved.  I didn't get that far.  I noticed right away that the tank was rattling around in the crate and when I removed the end panel found that there was no packing material.  Just a few pieces of crumpled up newspaper.
When I removed the tank I discovered that one of the top flanges was bent over.  Not so bad that it could not be fixed, but bad enough.
Also the welds were really bad.  I mean High School weld shop bad.  Big thick welds that in some cases had to be ground off.  Worse, in a couple of places the welds had been ground off so bad it had gone into the base material.
Next there was a big bulge on the trunk exposed face.  To me this was a sign of either bad forming, over heating during weld, or damage from shipping.  I could not tell.
And finally Jorge's attitude has not changed.  He did offer me $50.00 off or to replace the tank at my expense, but when I declined he became very hostile.  More verbal abuse to me and to his employees.  He seems to think all that goes wrong is some body else's fault, and not his. It's his business.
So tank was sent back.  This time it only cost me the return shipping charge.
Stupid me.
Timeforwalkies



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